What you're saying essentially is you're not that invested in your work
That has societal repercussions in an organization when so many people who are essentially uninvested show up to work on any given day there's an unspoken ethos of defeatism that permeates every interaction
The casual clothing is a smell like any other in code that indicates precisely this bullshit mentality and it doesn't scale beyond the very initial phases
My success as an architect or senior dev or supervising senior dev or practice lead (all hats I've worn just like the knit beanie I wear every day) all depend on a senior management team above me that remains relaxed, open to new ideas, and collaborative. I need them to view me as a flexible resource that works just as hard to understand their needs and concerns as I do to understand those of the engineers at the firm.
That's why I wear jeans and a tshirt when I'm meeting with internal teams and I put on a suit and tie (or at least a cashmere sweater and slacks) when I meet with clients or mostly senior management teams.
I need openness and collaboration between peers who frequently and stubbornly misunderstand each other and by signaling that I'm not explicitly playing for either team I foster that openness and collaboration.
Often managers smirk or chuckle at my casual attire and engineers are wary and look askance at my Tie Bar wool ties and designer shoes when I am attending a workshop.
I dress for the audience, not for me. Stubbornly adhering to any other standard is dumb.
Look I appreciate the sentiment but I'm calling bullshit
You're putting way too much effort into choosing a look whereas in a real professional world everyone would choose to exnovate at one kind of outfit and move on to more important matters
But I do agree there are moments when you dress for yourself and moments when you dress for others
During work it's 100% dress for the team and client
As a senior software developer start-up founder and process consultant I'm telling you dress is an important semaphore that most people fumble badly and it only serves to amplify the control dramas and false corporate power dynamics
Your beanie is not only a beanie it's a badge of entitlement
I get paid and the work gets done. I don’t have to be passionate about it. It’s just work.
I recommend introspection as it relates to life choices and identity. Nobody cares about their job on their death bed, only wishing they had prioritized more time with friends, family, and loved ones. Work backwards from there, and optimize to be happy with what you valued and how you spent your life. A job generates income, but is not who you are as a human.
TLDR Treating work as just work, and not something of significant importance, is not toxic IMHO. On the contrary, it is the healthiest way to address it as a necessary (for now) part of our lives. YMMV. Good luck.
Hey I appreciate that but I don't have the luxury to treat it like anything but survival I used to be very laid back but as you said once again I am not willing to compromise things I value a lot in exchange for things I value less in other words 8 hours a day doing something I don't care about to gain one hour at best with people I care about sounds like a bad deal
I can't help thinking how much effort would be saved if everyone wasn't so busy being busy while trying to seem somehow aloof it's pure toxicity I don't see anything good coming out of it but you're right YMMV you've only got one life to invest in doing whatever you feel is best
Whether I spend my day playing foosball and drinking kombucha with a bunch of ass dragging laggards or saving orphan refugees in a war zone I'll be equally tired when I get home to my family
After a decade or more of doing the same thing and having the same asinine conversations with an endlessly changing cast of quirky but equally uninvested dilberts I begin to ask myself my kids are stuck in daycare for this shit?
Some of us say meh life is but a born - work - die type of proposition just have another cup of company coffee for the road while others ask why the fuck are we still wearing clothes from the mall
We're both looking at the same evidence and drawing different conclusions I respect your opinions but I wouldn't want to work in an environment like that my whole life because I genuinely have better things to do
I'm a software engineer. What matters is the code I produce. If I wear a tie, the tie does not wind up in the source code control system. If wear jeans, the compiler does not care. You're confusing the trappings of professionalism for the actual professionalism. They are not the same thing.
I think it's possible to invest a whole life under someone's thumb being compared against KPI's and other metrics and get neither professionalism nor the trappings of it
Taking the trappings even when they're not on offer is the way to show the intention of taking the substance of the thing because I refuse to be bought and sold by people who don't have the same understanding or appreciation for this discipline
You're naive if you really believe that how long have you been in this industry
Do you seriously believe the software you produce in isolation has any bearing on the world outside your window?
The only thing that matters is the quality of communication within the organization and most organizations behave like casually dressed socialist dystopias producing code that precisely reflects the petty squabbles and false power struggles that go into it
You're being bought and sold by management bros high fiving each other and missing
How long have I been in this industry? 35 years. Your view does not accurately reflect my experience in this industry.
Two unrelated suggestions for you:
1. You can edit a comment for two hours after you submit it. You don't have to keep making parallel comments or replying to yourself.
2. Use punctuation. It would make your writing much more readable. (And if you're not trying to be readable, then you're just wasting your time and ours by posting here.)
Also you're meant to read my comments like Chris Walken just pause when you please and extract any sort of meaning you wish after all we're all just shouting at ourselves by proxy
What you're saying essentially is you're not that invested in your work
That has societal repercussions in an organization when so many people who are essentially uninvested show up to work on any given day there's an unspoken ethos of defeatism that permeates every interaction
The casual clothing is a smell like any other in code that indicates precisely this bullshit mentality and it doesn't scale beyond the very initial phases