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> After one hour, wire transfers sent in error are no more recoverable than crypto.

The receiver account can still be seized by government institutions though, something much harder with cryptocurrencies.



You would think, but in all scammer cases that I heard, they are able to get their money out.

I really don't get it, because I have to provide my ID every year or so for verification. I really don't get how these scammer can get away with that, but obviously every time.


Its easy to get fake ids that look very real (ask a local 20 year old).

Also you often do not even need to take a picture of an ID to open an account online, just have the info of an identity that you steal. After that, you get an atm card, wear a covid mask, shades and hat, call to raise the limit and take it out asap.


Which banks allow non-trivial ATM withdraw limits?

My experience with 4 different banks:

1. Limit of $500 cannot be changed

2. Limit raised to $1,100 over the phone; apparently if I show up at a branch and bring my first born, I can get it as high as $1,500.

3. Limit of $500 suddenly reduced to $200 (!) with the option to call in and raise it to $400.

4. Limit raised to $2,000. Some years later, suddenly reduced to $1,000. Haven't bothered looking into this yet.


Fidelity Investments brokerage and cash management accounts have a limit of $1000 a day, and I have four of them, so I can get $4000.

I recently learned that some Chase Bank ATMs inside branches used with Chase ATM cards can get $3000 in one transaction. I did it the first time a few days ago.


Good to know, thanks. Fidelity is actually my example #1. I've been told multiple times on the phone it can't be changed from $500, but that was years ago. Will try again.

Back to the topic, we're up to $3-4k now which is more than I thought, but still not enough to pull off this $12k scam.


Fidelity outsources their debit card servicing. A Fidelity rep told me that the cap is set per customer, and the withdrawal limit is set depending on the account balance and history with that customer. They told me that I could request a higher withdrawal limit if I wished to do so, and they may or may not approve it.


Interesting, I didn't think it was per-customer. At the time these conversations happened, I had plenty of money, most of it in my Fidelity account.

They could have saved a lot of money on ATM fees (which they always refund me) by increasing my limit, that's for sure.


Any particular reason you need so much cash on hand?


You never know when a good poker game will break out.


I travel a lot, and sometimes often to "emerging economies". Cash is always king, especially when your American bank puts yet another suspected fraud alert on your card...


What comes to my mind, is when you buy a boat or a motor second hand.


Rich people banks, like schwab.


They can use an account registered for a homeless person who has happily provided an ID in exchange for a small amount of money.


What's the next step, after the stolen money has landed in the homeless persons account?


>The receiver account can still be seized by government institutions

That is hardly an advantage for the victim. Come to think of it, that's a (rare but realistic) threat for normal, licit commerce.


What do you think the government does with the money? Keep it?


It costs you more to do the work to recover your money than you get back. The government's contribution is only the general deterrence, which has no effect to attackers from hostile nations.




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