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You can't really use the word Zionist anymore because everyone has a completely different definition of what it means.

So you're going to have to define your particular flavor before using it.

To me virtually everyone on earth is a Zionist because it just means "having your own country", which is something almost everyone wants. I'm sure your definition is different.



To me Zionism is the settler colonial national project of Israel as a Jewish supremacy state on Palestinan lands.

If you support Israel as a Jewish supremacy state which denies civil rights to the Palestians that live there or were expelled (or descendants of expelled Palestinians) in 1947-1948, then you are a Zionist.

If you support a state called Israel which has equal rights for all its civilians (including Palestinians, and right of return for displaced Palestinians and their descendants, regardless of a whether you support a separate independent Palestine along the 1967 borders (as long as you recognize the right of return for the 1948 refugees to Israel), then you are not a Zionist.

I know Zionism comes in various flavors, including very extreme forms (such as Kahanism), and not all Zionists support the genocide done in their name. But as I understand it, no Zionist completely supports equal civil rights for all Palestinians, including the right of return and reparations for Palestinian refugees, because if they did support that, they wouldn’t be Zionists, at least not in my books.


So you should know that this definition of Zionism that you use was created by antisemities.

No actual Zionist uses this definition. It's also not a factual reality of how Israel started, Israel is not a settler project, it's not colonial, and it was not built on Palestinian lands. None of that is true. Zionism is Jews returning to their own land, not the land of others.

But I am well aware that people like to pretend it's true, (and then criticize it). If you spend a lot of time online you'll hear this definition over and over, and people actually start to believe it's real.

Israel already has equal rights for all civilians inside Israel. The people in the area not in Israel of course are not Israeli, and they were offered a state of their own, which they refused (multiple times).

> because if they did support that, they wouldn’t be Zionists, at least not in my books.

Tons of Zionists want that, they call them leftists in Israel, but they are also Zionists. They used to be far more numerous, but multiple Palestinian attacks have greatly reduced their numbers. (It's one of the ironies of Oct 7 that the Palestinians primarily killed those people advocating for a Palestinian state.)

The fact that you say "they wouldn't be Zionists" makes it quite clear that you don't actually know what Zionism is!


Evidently Theodore Herzl was not a Zionist.


I looked at a couple of definitions of Zionism.

Wikipedia:

> Zionism is an ethnocultural nationalist movement that emerged in late 19th-century Europe to establish and support a Jewish homeland through the colonization of Palestine.

Brittanica:

> Zionism, Jewish nationalist movement with the goal of the creation and support of a Jewish national state in Palestine.

Jewish Vioce for Peace (an Anti-Zionist organization):

> Zionism is a form of Jewish nationalism, and is the primary ideology that drove the establishment of Israel.

> The political ideology of Zionism, regardless of which strain, has resulted in the establishment of a Jewish nation-state in the land of historic Palestine.

https://www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org/resource/zionism/

Jewish center for justice (a Zionist organization):

> Zionism is the belief in the Jewish people’s right to self-determination in our ancestral homeland of Israel.

> Today, supporting Zionism means promoting the continued existence of a Jewish state and upholding the right of Jews to live freely in their historic homeland.

https://jewishcenterforjustice.org/what-is-zionism-six-thing...

Zioness.org (a Zionist publication):

> The progressive movement for liberation and national self-determination of the Jewish people in our indigenous homeland, the land of Israel.

Zack Beauchamp (A journalist and a Liberal Zionist):

> Zionism is Israel’s national ideology. Zionists believe Judaism is a nationality as well as a religion, and that Jews deserve their own state in their ancestral homeland, Israel.

https://www.vox.com/2018/11/20/18080010/zionism-israel-pales...

There is a varying degree in what these definitions call the land in question (Israel; Jewish ancestral homeland; etc.; I just call it Palestine) and where exactly that land is (1967 borders; Israel + occupied territories; Israel + Sinai + Jordan + South Lebanon + ect.). There is also a varying degree of how much rights to grant the indigenous population. Liberal Zionists want to grant them equal rights as a minority, while Kahanists want to expel them again in a Geoncide. But all Zionists agree that Zionism is a national project to maintain a Jewish supremacy state in Palestine.

A liberal Zionist would refute the description Jewish supremacy because in a democratic Israel all citizens should have the same rights. I refute that refutation on the basis that without the right of return for the 1948 refugees, Israel has artificially created a racial majority on lands that did not belong to them, and thus have created a supremacy through majority rule via a violent expulsion of the indigenous population.




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